TMIC Group buy?

may i open a group buy for the Top mount intercooler as Vpulsar alias Knight of knee has done for him?
the aim is to go by the club to get a participation for the events...

organisation is still to define and discuss.

The work is based on a old unit, re-cored by a professional, with a WRC type core.
cores takes 10 day to arrive, and there is 1 day of work on each units.

prices are :
for 1 unit = 300 pounds + 15 delivered
for 5 units = 280 pounds
for 10 units = 250 pounds
+ small amount (to define with the admins)

who would be interested in?  

Fred wouldn't it be a good idea to get proof this is more beneficial.
As I am sure a standard top mount can do the same job, be it slightly more restrictive.
Rob's aim was to run no more than 350. The top mount issues i.e heat soak in stop start warm weather driving conditions, so had people using front mounts for better flow and remove the inter warmer issues.
I just think tests need to be done first to prove its worth while.
Have tests even been done on the Arc over standard? Would like to see.
As if the results are very minimal and do not make much difference why bother.
Not trying to put anyone off but it needs to be justified as spending this much on a recored top mount..hmmm not too sure.

I would have thought, standard top mount and water injection/ menthol would be sufficient.
The whole point of the front mount was to get better airflow. Yes I know some people may not want to chop up their front bumper or sections of the front end, and some may experience more lag depending on the pipework routing and length.
But if you use any kind of top mount but no airflow gets to it, it's pointless, weather arc, std, or re cored.
If you are stuck in traffic, hot weather and you do not drive above 20mph for the whole journey I am sure you will be plagued with the same issues. It's only when you to get better flow I.e high driving speeds that you will see differences. Hence wrc cars can proved real tests on the re cored top mounts as they are driving at manic speeds and getting true air flow at the top mounts.

Just my thinking, maybe i am wrong....Discuss...

P.s have. Read on this interesting top mount comparison and a font mount. Looking at core/ mass/ flow.
http://www.autospeed.com/cms/article.html?&A=1946

andy sunny gti wrote:But if you use any kind of top mount but no airflow gets to it, it's pointless.
Weather you have a std top mount, arc, or this new re cored one. If you are stuck in traffic, hot weather and you do not drive above 20mph for the whole journey I am sure you will be plagued with the same issues. It's only when you to get better flow I.e high driving speeds that you will see differences.

that's not entirely true
its a fact that the arc topmount does flow more air than the stock topmount and keeps the charge temps lower due to the bar and plates being larger and less of them which aids airflow.

and as for a tmic cooking in traffic well that's true but only due to heatsoak from the engine which is why I suggested fitting a thermal plate inbetween the bracket and rocker cover to stop the heat rising up directly into the core and raising charge temps.

other than that there is absolutely no difference between a tmic and fmic setup as both will have ample cold air once vehicles moving but both will suffer from heat issues when stuck in traffic as neither will have any air forced through the cooling fins. infact the fmic setup could actually be worse than a tmic as on many the out pipe runs directly over the ex manifold which is pumping out huge amounts of heat plus the pipe is thinwall steel which will absorb heat far easier than the alloy up pipe on a tmic setup that does not run directly over the ex manifold.

if you want added cooling whilst stationary you could always do what someone has done on a car weve just bought in and fit a kenlowe fan to the underside of the big bonnet scoop
il take a photo of it if you like, and this car was running well in excess of 500bhp

as for the tmic that robs ordered no they have not been tested but the bar/plate design is similar to arc so I think they would be a good buy for that kind of money as a s/h arc you will pay more for.
then lets not forget the minimal lag times of a tmic setup, much better than fmic unless you have a mega short pipe run

so yes if theres enough interest then we will let a group buy go ahead and il get a new section made up to put group buys in

Front mounts have definitely been proven to be more beneficial when it comes to air flow and cooling, core and mass volume Bob.

I think Robs main concen is it looking standard and supporting 350bhp.

But those using front mounts and wanting to convert back to this will sacrifice cooling, flow capacity over standard looks surely?

The pace front mount kit needs no cutting to the gtir standard front end features.

yes they are beneficial if your running big power as you rightly say due to the larger mass of the core plus its slap bang directly in front of car so will get maximum airflow when cars moving, but not much difference when stationary sitting in traffic as both will suffer with heatsoak to some degree.
as said the tmic with a heat absorbant plate placed above the rocker cover will be more than adequate for most peoples needs with there 300-350hp (where a majority of these cars are at) and the arc unit is a better flowing item than a stock tmic that's a fact.
a lot of people fitted fmic kits because at the time 'like many things' everyone thought it looked good and people were fooled into believing there car would be faster with one fitted.
ive proven this years back that 2 cars same spec same boost but one with tmic and one with fmic, the one with tmic accelerates faster over a set distance due to having much less lag with a stock t28 tubby.
the good thing having a fmic setup is that its much easier to work on the car as you've not got to unbolt all the crap to get to simple things

anyway we could argue over whats better all day long as were each entitled to our own opinions on what you believe to be better plus its been discussed a hundred times over now.
but this is about the group buy at end of the day so its up to people if they want one or not, all im saying is that if people did want one is that its a very good price its irrelevant to us whether people buy them or not!

Fair play and explained well Bob.
Feel free to move this post into Robs topic and let Fred resume the group buy.

1. Fred

Good sum up for all! Thanks for this debate. Yes i want one...but others?
Thanks bob for opening the group buy section.

1. Fred

looks like your the only one interested fred so not much of a group buy lol

ah ah, you're right bob, so no need a group buy...  

Hope it's not my fault..lol
Delete my debate and start again..lol
Rob of knee, come and back up your revolution..lol

Lol, not enough interest cause FMIC are more agressive and cheaper on ebay!

no problem, i'll get mine and that's all, i'll make a review of it once received and mounted on!!

I'm looking at having one made at some point but as said if there isn't the interest Fred just sort yourself one.

Top mount is well underrated. original is  actually very good & performed well when tested against many other standard intercoolers.
Decent effort in adding thermal barrier above rocker cover is a huge help in reducing heat soak but it not really that much of an issue (pending on regional climate) & if you stuck in traffic you not really going to be needing max boost/power.
ARC or quality recore upgrade can be good for a lot more than 350hp.
Most people went front mount as it was a fad at  the time & ebay provided you with a shiny monkey metal kit for 99p lol .
Sure for serious high boost builds or serious track use a quality front mount is only way to keep airflow & temp sensible. for the rest a decent effort on top mount improvements can reap benefits & retain vehicle value.
Decent charge cooler would be my preference for higher power or very hot climate countries & lends itself well to GTiR layout.

I've ordered a re-cored one, as knight of knee done. It's on it's way.

I'll get back to this thread once receive and put on the car.

Fred. Did you send your old unit in ?

Im looking at getting a new core on my arc.

Good old debate lol, My new turbo will apparently run over 400 bhp so my new top mount better perform lol, I was told that it should be 3 times better than the standard top mount and is a lot like the ARC one only 20 years newer and using the latest WRC spec core.

I am ceramic coating the manifold/elbow and standard heat shields which will help with under bonnet temps I'm sure, I agree with what bob was saying about being stuck in traffic both top mount and front mount will suffer just the same, And once the traffic clears the top mount wont take much more than a couple of hundred yards to cool back down I'm sure so it doesn't bother me much at all, It will be fine for track days and drag racing if I choose to use it for that kind of thing, But seeing as it's costing a hell of a lot of money to build it might just be a polish dolly lol.


Most importantly to me when you open my bonnet it will look pretty much like it left the factory, Just imagine a jet black pulsar on 14" standard wheel looking box standard under the bonnet but running 400+ BHP hopefully.


Rob

jaypjay wrote:Fred. Did you send your old unit in ?

Im looking at getting a new core on my arc.

yes! actually i bought one off ebay at 10 pounds including the delivery!! and i made it recored, works well, but for the moment in standard set up!!

keep your ARC or sell it and make one standard recore!

fred05 wrote:

jaypjay wrote:Fred. Did you send your old unit in ?

Im looking at getting a new core on my arc.

yes! actually i bought one off ebay at 10 pounds including the delivery!! and i made it recored, works well, but for the moment in standard set up!!

keep your ARC or sell it and make one standard recore!

I bought a second hand one off flea bay to have re-cored to Fred    Great minds   .

I'd sell the ARC one to mate you might get £400 + for it given how stuff is selling these days, Then spend £300 having a standard one done quid's in matey.

Good deal i think! Even if you sell it 250 its à good deal to go with a new one, withour corrosion

The stock tanks are much smaller than the arc tanks am I right ? Plus the core is thicker.

yes the tanks and core are bigger on the arc
but tbh the ones that rob & fred have had made up look to be good quality flowing units.

its like anything sometimes.........people pay extra just because its a branded name

I appreciate that I'm coming into this discussion a few years too late, but I want to get my TMIC Recored. I can't see that there was actually a group buy before. Is there any interest? If not then can someone recommend where I can get this done?